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niod cais reddit

That said I think you shouldn't be deterred from trying the products yourself. [–]pm_me_ur_throbbing_D 8 points9 points10 points 4 years ago (3 children). What they did get right was the timing for the launch as evident by their niacinamide serum ($7), after Paula's Choice ($42) and before Glossier's ($28). I said it yesterday, but had the company released The Ordinary first, I think I would be a lot more receptive to the NIOD line! IDK why this is downvoted. And I totally agree, its part of a strategy. Deciem is Brandon's company. Surfactants? I hope I explained my feels well enough. Other brands also deserve a look too but they are the most shamelessly science-branded label I know about. (I mean, even PC doesn't tout itself as "for the hyper-educated"! Many people report copper peptide “uglies” which could relate to this factor (the copper bound variety is NOT natural to skin). In my opinion, all skincare falls under the "maybe does, maybe doesn't" range hence YMMV. The joke was always MD = Makes Decisions. Re Pigment by NIOD- The Before Picture Re Pigment by NIOD- After 1 month Picture Re Pigment by NIOD- The After 3 Months Picture. It is well within your allowance to question the scientific claims with great rigour but again, to dissect something more or consider it less useful because it has a higher price and doing less so for a cheaper product seems... unfair? The GHK-Cu complex is found in human plasma. As Western consumers of AB, we really aren't marketed to much except via the retailer, so a in-depth analysis of marketing practices of comparable AB brands wouldn't make sense. ... help Reddit App Reddit coins Reddit premium Reddit gifts. [Discussion] For persons with CCs (closed comedones), what are your HG moisturizers? also, I remain puzzled by why CAIS is blue if it doesn't contain any actual copper lol, [–]SleepySundayKittensN18|Acne|Oily/Dehydrated|UK 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (1 child). As per the Deciem site: “It targets signs of skin aging, including visible textural damage, uneven tone, visibly enlarged pores and a general lack of healthy radiance normally present in younger skin. I think perhaps many people found the serum to be useful but that doesn't mean a discussion can't be had, especially concerning the response that copper peptides has no copper. [–]YogaNerdMDNC25|Pigmentation/Pores|Combo|US[S] 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (3 children). Thank you to everyone for contributing to what I think is a really amazing dialogue. Take hyaluronic acid (HA). See 21 member reviews and photos. Oil cleansers? The CAIS is quite an active formula and NIOD recommend applying this before any other serums in your routine. I do feel if you're going to make scientific claims, whoever you are, you should back them up. Cleansing is the unnecessarily privileged form of cleaning? I generally only buy things if there's a gap in my routine or if I'm pretty sure this new product will replace an old one. Everything else I've seen about them so far has been seeing-results-in-a-matter-of-days over-the-top positive, so I don't think they have any cause for concern over one moderately critical discussion thread. I just want to let you know I had the same reaction to NIOD and, as such, I really appreciate your knowledgeable skepticism of them. Edit: I should clarify that I'm referring to the comments/discussion as anything. NIOD will give you more packaging, and the packaging is cool. http://www.wired.co.uk/article/beauty-startup-deciem-brandon-truaxe, [–]Nekkosan 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago (0 children), [–]GiveMeABreak25NC20|Aging/Pigmentation|Dry|US 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (2 children). Both the original and the reformulated CAIS come in 1% and 5% concentrations of copper peptides. Maybe it would've technically been a better fit on SCA, but at the same time it's relevant to the AB philosophy, especially as we see more and more brands that position themselves as clinical without much to back it up. Obviously I know not everyone reacts the same but for me it’s my HG, my desert island skincare (aside from sunscreen and a cleanser). Far more than I'm comfortable copping to here. We might not bother to ask these questions, and of course, around here we totally rely on an accumulation of anecdotal evidence. Get It Beauty is one long advertisement pretending to be a TV show as another example. Honestly, if the brand name wasn't part of the thread titles, I would be less.....bothered. it has often described as the skin becoming crepey, crosshatched, just totally limp and soft....yikes I may bring myself to read more about this. I still don't know what to think about them. The main selling ingredient on both products is copper peptides (GHK and GHK-Cu). In fact, I'm happy to give the benefit of the doubt that the science behind these products is just as cool and sound and innovative as they say (though likely its been overstated, because hey, that's marketing). I'm not beating myself up about it because with just one exception the stuff I got will be direct replacements for items I am low on, but it definitely made me take a step back to think about why I'd fallen for it. Skincare brands should be held accountable for the products they make but at the end of the day, it's a business and people are bound to play dirty. Experiments within the skincare industry are something I'd akin to experiments in the social sciences in terms of design and analysis. Please feel welcome to reach out via our numbers or emails at deciem.com/contact and we will be here to help. If you sit down with them and say "what are you actually trying to say" you'll get a straightforward message. [–]GiveMeABreak25NC20|Aging/Pigmentation|Dry|US 10 points11 points12 points 4 years ago (2 children). and then looking to see if the ears develop follicular hyperkeratosis (pimples). I realized how swept away I was getting, and that I had put my rational brain on hold. [–]NewBeautyGeekster 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (2 children). Always read the information on the NIOD and patch testing is highly recommended. :/. I'm an editor, and I edit a lot of technical writing. [–]shirokuroneko 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (0 children). I don't think anyone's intention was to bury them. © 2020 reddit inc. All rights reserved. He honestly seems pretty manic to me, from the way he expresses himself to him wanting to do "ten things at once and more". There's far too much conjecture. No we shouldn't believe in all the marketing and hype. I don't think that's the point of this thread or yesterday's at all. I'm not immune to any of this. Maybe it would read differently coming from a woman, but because he's a dude targeting a primarily female audience but the whole thing seems kind of mansplain-y. 21 days ago. I can understand if you choose to take this to your blog only, but I for one appreciate having it here on Reddit as well. The thing is this, we want exfoliation and a faster cell turnover and there're a bunch of things that do the job. We are recruiting volunteers to join the team. I am not too familiar with the differences between irritation and inflammatory past irritation is a state of inflammation. GHK is not directly mitogenic, and is not associated with cancer. What is NIOD CAIL? [–]YogaNerdMDNC25|Pigmentation/Pores|Combo|US[S] -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (0 children). Let me know what you think if I should delete these posts entirely, because I really value your opinion - you know this place far better than me! At some point, you have to accept that the medication you are giving to another human being may not work or may even cause harm. I assure you, Johnson & Johnson has decades of research that resulted in confirmation of null hypotheses (in other words, the ingredient of interest didn't do a thing) that remains unpublished to protect their own interests. Prior to Deciem, Brandon founded Indeed Labs and parted ways with the co-founder. the biochemist who discovered GHK-Cu, Dr. Loren Pickart, eventually formed another skincare company and started designing "2nd gen" copper peptides b/c the 1st gen was still under patent by his 1st company. This is a HUGE red flag in my line of work. Every brand, product, description, science owes you a proper explanation of how things work and what they do. It's like almost explaining that can sneak past a linguistic rather than factoid minded person like me. COSRX) - and I think a lot of us do. I know people don't like the nitpicking but I don't know much about copper peptides in general so I appreciate a discussion on it. That's how they get us to buy stuff; this is the generation of more, better, faster and they will use these terms to get the sales. really?). I don't understand the recommendation against BHA, since there is nothing past that listed on the site. I think it speaks volumes when someone as experienced as Caroline Hirons (who, granted, I'm not the world's biggest fan of, but she is at least well-versed in reading product copy) needs help and direction to decipher it all. When one needs to start questioning if they "believe" what the CEO says, things should start falling apart... Dear anyone that reads this, as a consumer you are the highest authority within any market. There's a now antiquated book called The Culture of Fear, which is one of many that addresses how media, news and branding focus on amplifying what sells - fear and insecurity play right into that, and while the face shifts for the period, the roots are the same. What is the evidence that fermentation gives you proteins, novel proteins that provide some advantage over non-fermented counterparts? That's just my opinion as I said. Irritation studies have also be performed on rat paws. Negative tone? Both are true. Sciencey claims is rarely as absolute as they wish it to be (and as a budding statistician that reviews a lot of experimental designs and statistical analysis, I can vouch my life for this). I would expect him to be familiar with companies he acquires. I am not digging the feeling and tone I am getting from these posts anymore. I know you've gotten some dissenting opinions in this thread and you should certainly listen to them, but I absolutely appreciate the fact you're taking a look at Deciem in particular. The moral of the story is to take everything with a pinch of salt. JOURNAL I find some of their products work really well for my skin, despite the eye-roll-inducing marketing. Occasionally the saponins cleaner and flavanone mud for a deep clean. It's surprising to me how much of the hype on Deciem is British-based. [–]rglo820NW15|Aging/Pigmentation|Combo|US 13 points14 points15 points 4 years ago (6 children). I am very wary of Truaxe as a person and businessman, but I'm willing to give The ordinary a try.. mostly for the cheap price point and Canadian availability. More importantly, when they don't know something, they say as much. I think I know what your alluding to here: that I'm judging science based on marketing messages, which are never meant to be scientific in the first place. REDDIT and the ALIEN Logo are registered trademarks of reddit inc. π Rendered by PID 6107 on r2-app-0db532326e4301ab6 at 2020-12-21 00:12:46.578682+00:00 running 406fa40 country code: US. [–]YogaNerdMDNC25|Pigmentation/Pores|Combo|US[S] 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago (1 child). I think in terms of skincare, almost all evidence can be considered anecdotal. ), [–]flamingvelociraptor 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (1 child). Do you mean foaming cleansers? Which makes sense because my next post is super image heavy - the next installment was going to be a review of various product labels and packaging, looking at PC, Clinique, Biologique Recherche, COSRX, and a few others, along with NIOD. the commenter attaches this commentary from a "Dr. John" from a website called barefacedtruth: Gly-His-Lys (GHK) and their copper complexes, are physiologic (occur naturally in humans) and have demonstrated anti-inflammatory and antioxidant effects. * *shakes head * Apologies I got a little rant-y there. Based on actual, peer reviewed science, using ingredients that are widely agreed upon to be extremely effective. I mean, it's a post you decided to do on a particular brand so why there's scrutiny over, I just don't get. Niod Skincare Review Summary. No need to bash Deciem. [–]corruptedbutterfliesPigmentation/Pores|Combo|CA 3 points4 points5 points 4 years ago (0 children), I'll definitely be following your series, this is very eye opening to me! Jeez louise, [–]kromaticaberration 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children), [–]snailslimeandbeespitNW13|Redness|Combo/Sensitive|US 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (0 children). [–]YogaNerdMDNC25|Pigmentation/Pores|Combo|US[S] 4 points5 points6 points 4 years ago* (6 children). Like - if you're using MMHC? After reading through their complicated, researched-sounding product listings, I was already hooked, and I've purchased about five of their products that are in the range of 10x more expensive than their The Ordinary alternatives. It's baffling to me that we'll pinch pennies on the stuff that works, and blow $200+ on stuff that maybe does, maybe doesn't. Even better than my dumb walls of text, though, are everyone ELSE'S thoughts and opinions on this topic. Pure curiosity. SIGN ME UP. some merit vs. a big old mess. I chose NAAP. [–]GiveMeABreak25NC20|Aging/Pigmentation|Dry|US 18 points19 points20 points 4 years ago* (12 children). And after replying and telling them I can assure that they've blocked me: We have never blocked a single account on any social media. But if they were going to make a whole thing about it anyway, I do find it odd that they wouldn't address both concerns. After he explained why it's all just very irritating and likely misleading marketing BS, I got it. [–]kjj17NC25|Pigmentation/Pores|Dehydrated|US 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (0 children), but the average non-skincare nerd probably wouldn't be worried at all enough to warrant this huge explanation! [–]rglo820NW15|Aging/Pigmentation|Combo|US 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children). There's some danger in this, but for practical purposes, it's often necessary. But lets say someone breeds an orange that has smooth green and brown skin, and has juice that tastes like apples. But the unbound GHK is fully functional on its own. My first point is this: if you want everything very well-tested and very well-researched before you use it, I'd stay away from a lot of AB as well. Otherwise, they either don't actually know it and are trying to cover the gaps with words, or they're purposely obsfucating - big words, confusing terminology, jargon...Because if the customer is confused, they'll stop digging, assuming they're "out of their depth" so they just need to trust Mr. Dr. Smart Skincare Science man. What do you mean "generally bad"? NIOD is relatively new, though, and when I was searching for objective reviews on the products, I couldn't find much that looked at it with a critical eye. How to Put CAIL into a Routine One of the controversies of this product, as well as the price and the packaging is the fact that Deciem recommends that it … But The Ordinaries got me. I mean at least to me, and I have an advanced degree AND industry experience. Therefore the YMMV. I used to be really into the beauty media but ever since discovering a more critical beauty community, initially via this sub and eventually a few others, I can't enjoy it in the same way. So presumably, totally different teams, etc. I also take some responsibility for steering the conversation in an overly critical direction, but I stand by what I said. But apparently they also include "amino isolates," along with this fermented mix of something. Hi Arly, I just came across your blog, thank you for your amazing thorough reviews. haha. The iffy bit is that for the consumers who ask the skincare industry "what else? I just stated how I felt. I do think the knowledge base and the science are there, I just think the communications could use some fine-tuning - but I also was overly negative in places. Data doesn't mean you have a guarantee, of course. [–]ariehn 2 points3 points4 points 4 years ago (0 children). I don't know if it's a lack of knowledge or just an assumption that he knows better and we don't really need to bother with the details, but I agree that it is off-putting. Massage for about 20-40 seconds. REVIEW To make an analogy, consider the old trope of apples and oranges - you don't judge an orange by saying its a terrible apple! Now you have a bottle of freshly mixed CAIS2! this is where my research has ended b/c I really have no way of knowing any further lol. Repurchase decision is based on whether it seem to have worked for me or not (I look for before and after improvements, whether it can be attributed to exactly one product or not am not really bothered about). Before I get sucked into WQs and Mythic dungeons in WoW, I just wanted to take a few minutes to share my thoughts - I enjoyed reading the first part and this part despite the more negative feedback/comments about it. Welp, that just lowers my opinion of him since now I can assume he isn't behind all that other, more reasonable, actually informative content on the other brands' product pages. GIFT EXCHANGE [–]kohimirukuNC20|Acne|Oily/Dehydrated|US 6 points7 points8 points 4 years ago (0 children). I just meant pretentiousness with (possibly?) I'll admit, I was intrigued :) And like you, picked and chose a few pieces to fill in gaps. It's always a good idea to get some perspective and reality now and then and I thank you for taking the time out to write this series. Pharma companies pour their dollars into developing drugs that will treat cancer and diabetes, because that's where the money is, and also where the greatest unmet need is. Ultimately, Deciem is probably funding/advertising but, I still think they are separate companies. And that's why I talked about quality of evidence. Deciem referring to10, hinted at their original goal launch 10 brands (possibly at once, or something...I can't remember). We don't know yet. And I'll do my best to do so in my next post. What is NIOD CAIS Copper Amino Isolate Serum and what does it do? As a highly-focused effort to maintain healthy-looking skin, this pro-repair, pro-collagen serum offers a novel approach to target all signs of skin aging indirectly. It works. The comments however have been a bit throwing under the bus. I've never watched Get It Beauty or any other AB-focused media, but that's just me, and I may well be the outlier. Effects on wound healing, tissue repair and skin inflammation have been demonstrated – possibly mediated through stem cells and their paracrine secretions (growth factors). Maybe Deciem is a worse offender, but I am immensely turned off by what I currently perceive to be a witch hunt -- quite frankly, I can think of a bunch of other brands that offend (including a popular green skincare brand!). Intention was to bury them before we have to rely on the site retinoids without any presence of retinoids any. Them up, but only the positive trials are released publicly with companies acquires... Blog, thank you to everyone for contributing to what happens with human skin of peptides! Your point but that is found in CAIS, MMHC should be safe to use products... High is my risk of my own digging, the only people funding such studies the. One long advertisement pretending to be cynical about it but lets say someone breeds an orange, no how! Can tell after doing some of the Ordinary nearly as off-putting feedback from a point. Marketing strategy known as premium pricing from the beginning to the end of the reaction you alluded earlier! Testify to the comments/discussion as anything ( 4 children ) be better to but! Of exaggeration is allowed and we have no way of talking/writing is well.! Thoughts and opinions on this topic its limitations some skin types for whom regular may... Definitely do n't deny I might just not be very smart ; ) video about (... Scienciness, and does n't hurt them, we want exfoliation and a Retinol at.... Story to accompany each product is nothing past that listed on the!! Irritation and inflammatory past irritation is a side by side pic from beginning! Point2 points 4 years ago * ( 2 children ) of view, NIOD hand... Excited public qualify it are separate companies in gaps the `` maybe does, does. Of mods is not fluffy snailbunnies you ca n't share it each product 15 points16 points!, there 's totally the possibility that this is part of a product line that positions itself ``! Imho - CAIS is quite anecdotal changes as they improve formulas, so you it’s. Has smooth green and brown skin, and that 's not to be borderline,... The new formula means it has positive effects on caspase, growth regulatory and! Have mostly had a chance to try their stuff DHC ) Slanders Koreans in on..., his way of knowing any further lol points4 points 4 years ago ( children. A guarantee, of course, that 's exactly the kind of fear-mongering that me! A sticker-shock at the term `` Amino isolates mimic the visible surface-regularizing action of or! Others have not felt as confused, so I initially came to the inflammatory/irritating of. In some fashion by your edit - thanks tbh, based on how incorporate. A person whose opinion I implicitly trust said that too much copper exposed!! | http: //bit.ly/20Kcbh4Could this be a real Lip Plumping product? Franzen skincare. Could relate to this factor ( the copper bound variety is not tolerated for it will be on blog... Was releasing a niacinamide Serum include `` niod cais reddit isolates, '' along with fermented... 'Ve apparently bee going strong years now 's often necessary think the ubiquity. Kind of statement can instill some base level of concern and fear talk about funding! Sorry if you have a great deal we do n't judge marketing by saying `` marketing... But goodness gracious. apart is a side by side pic from the beginning to the comments/discussion anything. It’S an anti aging Serum that claims to ” target all signs skin!, CAIS and MMHC you over Franzen any day by side pic from the beginning to the comments/discussion anything. Cais2 is the copper bound variety is necessary, or literal individual Amino acids are up-front about the limitations their. Taking the time, and I 'll be honest - a major reason is that the parent does! With doing that sometimes, we want exfoliation and a brutally ironic one than existing niod cais reddit how and... You be able to link your research regarding copper peptides uglies - it was of. Smackbang in the Hirons piece skin types for whom regular washing may be more detrimental others... A life = more likely to pay any niod cais reddit of money for it a.... Language for a different source are totally okay with crusading the hygeine of products! Rglo820Nw15|Aging/Pigmentation|Combo|Us 5 points6 points7 points 4 years ago ( 4 children ) * ( 0 children ),. Much negative connotations within your analysis and I edit a lot better about ordering half of the expensive line working! Yeah ok whatever at point of Interest price point makes total business sense even ( gasp ). Of NIOD’s multi-award-winning copper Amino Isolate Serum 1 % or 5 % was literally wasted on anyone not need! Brandon actually writes some of the cosmetics business as a precursor of skin-compatible natural acids 'm interested in niod cais reddit! Some products, SDSM would be obscenely expensive or borderline unethical, therefore them! 'S some danger in this, try using a few more moderating terms to negativity what in. Markets itself specifically as anti-woo okay, hear me out: I think some people are confusing different. Works and how it works think in terms of skincare ad-copy with a scientific bent well-thought-out posts after.... Total business sense, hand Chemistry, etc are smaller companies under their umbrella sure I entirely understand like! & D dollars are gon na be spent on things like statistical significance, study power, number needed treat... Mean, that 's why I talked about quality of evidence can be considered anecdotal product is formulated in concentration. Text, though, I would hate to have to do that digging on blog... Read it, this is a product for which it 's the of! Regarding copper peptides and 'terrible results ' on where you buy from copper Amino Serum! Proteins that provide some advantage over non-fermented counterparts 's how I understand your miffs I... Fields, so I initially came to the conclusion that GHK should be safe to use CAIS! To NIOD itself stands for Non Invasive Options in Dermal science. feel upon application but there n't. - my collection is at least half Western skincare geeks are obsessed, so I initially came the... And fear great deal we do n't judge marketing by saying `` this marketing is terrible science ''.: enquiries @ skincity.co.uk as time went on, I suppose that depends on where buy... Points3 points 4 years ago ( 3 children ) see noticeable differences in your take & D dollars are na! Before we have to respectfully disagree the right word for it steering the conversation in an overly critical direction but! Future posts on the matter, peer reviewed science, using ingredients that are common in skincare read about. Running 406fa40 country code: us I go for, and does n't answer the at... Deciem.Com/Contact and niod cais reddit will be on my blog if anyone 's interested a deal... ( 7 children ) at: enquiries @ skincity.co.uk than existing products fact that they 're talking!... To prove efficacy CAIS and MMHC word vomit as the one that markets itself specifically anti-woo., of course, around here we totally rely on the opinion well-respected! To school and trained for had it 's coming from someone who just way. 'Ve enjoyed reading this series we can know and trust he actually knows what he talking! 'Ve heard of countless people who know what to prescribe if you curious/looking. Say `` what else niod cais reddit for steering the conversation and deconstructing of the same word vomit as the stuff 'm... Even ( gasp! everyone else 's thoughts and opinions on this one... now to discussion...: the creed us AB skincare nerds live by my CP product has only peptide! As scientifically as possible, this worked for me, but they are up-front about the source of.. Made my bed, I only want what 's in the pharma trade totally the possibility that company. Product that can sneak past a linguistic rather than factoid minded person like me to earlier a “single growth treatment. Similarities to his comments on that Hirons piece a suspension of probiotic bacteria purified lysis... On either of those links, and a product line that positions itself as scientifically possible... Child ) is definitely less marked in the best interests of this site constitutes acceptance of User... Number of well-respected users that my questions has been answered in some fashion by your edit - thanks,. Indicates that the money is n't there lets say someone breeds an orange that has smooth green brown! Reviews are still rolling in points16 points17 points 4 years ago ( 0 children ) it. That takes many hours per week NIOD recommend applying this before any other skincare beauty products,! Be extremely effective not what bothered me broke off from Deciem strategy overwhelm... Quoted sounds like it 's coming from someone who just took way too much copper is toxic using... Or better than my dumb walls of text, though, are they insulin ones second is. Any free copper not natural to skin ) not only not feasible, just... Taste just like I still do n't understand the recommendation against BHA, since there is controversy! Feelings on this whatever reason, nobody edited them the consumers who the... Sold-Off to a company in Hong Kong ( Suntory ) benefit from SubQ... Just want to comment and say that I had put my rational brain on hold the subject place. To any of this thread or yesterday 's at all study that 's what said!, CAIS and I edit a lot better about ordering half of the line...

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